Revelation Of Grace Part 4 – Lawson Perdue & Andrew Wommack
The Revelation Of Grace Part 4 from Pastors Lawson & Andrew Wommack. In the final episode of this special series, you will be reminded that it is by the grace of God that we are where we are and that by his grace we’ll be able to do what He’s called us to do.
The Imagination Package includes some of our teachings from Pastor Lawson and Jesse Duplantis to help you understand the power of using our imagination. This bundle consists of Insights Into Faith, Divine Imagination, and Power of a Positive Imagination.:
Revelation Of Grace Part 4 Transcript
Praise the Lord friends and I’m so glad that you tuned in with us today. I have my good friend and mentor, Andrew Wommack with me. We’re talking about the “Revelation of Grace.” Paul made a statement in 1 Corinthians 15:10, where he said, “I am what I am by the grace of God.” And you know what? If it wasn’t for the grace of God, we wouldn’t be where we are, a lot of us doing what we’re doing. So thank God for the grace of God. Open your heart and receive the word today. Blessings. Friends it’s so good to have you with us today. I’ve got my good friend Andrew Wommack my mentor, and he helped me. I received the baptism, the Holy Spirit in his ministry and was called to preach 44 years ago.
Man, we were both young kids back then.
Yeah, you were 29.
I was 29 and you were 14.
Wow! What a change.
Who would’ve known what God was gonna do in our life Lawson?
It’s just really amazing.
I was believing God for good things, but again, I didn’t know exactly. I just knew that God had called me to preach. You knew that God had called you to preach, but man, we went different ways and back together again. And it’s just God.
Yeah, it’s just amazing.
There’s no explanation.
It’s amazing what the Lord does.
I think if people would’ve told me back in, when was that 78?
If people would’ve told me back in 78 what God would’ve done in my life, I would’ve not been surprised, but I would’ve been overwhelmed. Like that would’ve been just more than I could have asked or thought. That’s been good.
I had a dream, and this is after you left and came up here to Colorado Springs, but I was only 17 or 18 years old, and I really saw myself preaching in a auditorium with 500 blue chairs. And then supernaturally when you bought the Elkton building, you invited us to bring the church in there for a period of time. And we were meeting across the street we had met in your building. Then we outgrew it and we’d met across the street at the Community Partnership for Child Development. But I was actually preaching a few weeks in there, and it’s like, that’s my dream. We had about 500 chairs. They were those blue chairs. I’m like, my dream has come to pass. And I told you about it, and you said that’s amazing. I paid for your dream.
That’s right. God made me pay for your dream. That’s awesome.
But you know that was amazing to me at that point in time, having a dream. And now we’re ministering to far more people than that every week in so many ways. And it’s just amazing what God’s done.
And it’s like we’ve been talking about all week. It’s the grace of God. It’s not you and me. We don’t deserve it. We cooperate. I tell people off and it’s, I feel like I dropped my Bible. I feel like it’s me riding on a rollercoaster and I’m just strapped in and holding on for dear life. I’m not controlling the thing. I’m not accelerating and causing it to go fast. I’m just holding on.
God is good.
Amen. So you’re in connected to the purpose and plan of God and He has it all figured out and we just need to stay close to Him.
And actually we talked a little bit about Galatians one, but in Galatians one, Paul says in verse six, “I marvel that you’re so soon removed from him who called you into the grace of Christ to another, which is not another, but there are some who pervert the gospel of Christ. So to move away from grace is to move away from Jesus.
That’s right. And also he uses the word grace and gospel interchangeably. If you aren’t preaching the grace of God, you aren’t preaching the gospel. And there are people that’ll stand up and they’ll say, “You’re going to hell.” And they’ll emphasize it and make it sound even worse. And they say, “That’s the gospel.” The word gospel means good news. And even more specifically I’ve researched it and I read this one commentary that says that the Greek word that was translated gospel was so rarely used outside of the Bible, that there’s only two examples of it in all of the Greek literature that we have existing. So it really means more than just good news, it’s nearly too good to be true news. And telling people that they’re going to hell if they don’t repent, that may be true, but it’s not good news. It’s the good news that even though you are headed to hell, because our sins separated us from God, the good news is that Jesus became sin for us and took all of God’s punishment and now offers it to us as a total free gift. And if you aren’t preaching about what God did for us, if it’s all about what you have to do for Him, it’s not the gospel.
No, it isn’t. It isn’t and that type of teaching really doesn’t attract a lot of people to Jesus. You know I was reading a book by T.L. Osborne, and this had to be about 1984, five, and I was married in 1984, and I remember as I was reading that book, it’s like this is almost too good to be true.
That’s exactly the Gospel.
And then I heard you preaching that this is what the gospel is. The gospel is the almost too good to be true news about what God has done for you in the person of Jesus.
And look at what Paul said here in Galatians chapter one. He says in verse eight, “But though we are an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you. Let him be a cursed,”
And that’s a strong language.
And in the Greek that means anathema. Damned to hell is what he’s talking about. And people I’m sure thought he can’t mean what he says. So in the next verse, he says, “As we said before, so I say now again, if any man preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached, let him be a curse.” Did you know if we were to apply this strictly to the church today in the United States. Man, there are a lot of churches. I don’t know how many, but I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s not over 50% of the churches are not preaching the gospel. They’re preaching law. They’re still under the Old Covenant.
They’re preaching performance more than their preaching Jesus.
You know I have people come up to me in my prayer lines and they’ll say things like, I fasted, I prayed, I study the word, I give my tithes. I do this, this, this, this. Why hasn’t God healed me? By saying that they told me, because they didn’t point to what Jesus did for them, they are pointing to what they had done for Jesus. It’s a performance based relationship. And that is not the gospel.
You know I go to church more than almost anybody, right? I mean I read the Bible through over and over. I love the word. You know I pray and praying is like easy as breathing. You know it’s just like, it just comes from your heart. You know I give and I give, Barbara and I give a very large percentage of our income.
Let me just interject because I know you won’t say it, but you give so much money to my ministry, and then I know other people. And like right now I came and you gave me an offering before we started these programs. You are one of the biggest givers I’ve ever seen in my life. And I know you wouldn’t say that, but people are watching your program need to know that.
Right, now this is a testimony on another, this is a personal testimony, and I haven’t done the numbers exactly, but I wrote a book on Provision: Releasing Supernatural Increase In Your Life. And you wrote a forward for me, and I so much appreciate it and Jesse Duplantis also, but I kind of was doing the math, I was sharing for Ashley Terradez and Billy Erhart was there in a conference Ashley was doing. But Barbara and I over our 40, we both been working about 40 years in our adult life. We have made about 1.4 million. Altogether that’s gross.
Yeah. But knowing where you come from, I remember when I first met you, that’s just a.
It’s like 40,000 a year or something between both of us. Over 40, over 40 years. Now we’ve made about 1.4 million total dollars working. We’ve given away roughly 500,000.
This is personal?
Personally. So we’ve given away about 29 to 30% of our income over these last 40 years. And our personal net worth is over $4 million. That supernatural.
You can’t figure that out.
No, no. That’s grace. That’s God.
You know it’s just like Jamie and I this, this year we’re giving about 140% of our annual income.
Yeah, it’s great.
And it’s not the first year we’ve given away 120% of our income before. We don’t do that every year you’d be broke. But I’m saying we give.
it’s because these investments and different things you live conservatively and you invest and do different things, and eventually that catches up. So that’s more than what you, and it’s an amazing way to live. But it’s the grace of God. And it’s the gospel, and it’s not what we’ve done. It’s what Jesus did for us. And we begin to under, you know, I first begin to hear about prosper. And really when you understand grace, in 2 Corinthians chapter eight and chapter nine, the Bible talks as much about grace as anywhere else in the New Testament. The only place that equals it is like Romans chapter four and five. But Paul’s talking about the grace of giving. But when you get involved in that, it’s just unreal.
There’s five times in 2 Corinthians eight that he uses the term grace to refer to giving. And then in chapter nine verse eight, God is able to make all grace abound towards you. That you always having all sufficiency in all things may abound unto every good work. So grace just affects everything. It’ll affect your prosperity level.
There are certain aspects of grace that will not be released to you if you don’t get involved in the grace of giving.
And you know some people that get ahold of grace, they use it as an excuse not to give. They don’t really understand grace.
No, and those are the same people that use grace as an excuse to go live in sin, and do things. That’s not true.
No sin will not have dominion over you.
I tell you, if you truly understand the goodness of God, the grace of God, it makes you so thankful that you’d give away everything if you possibly could. You just love God that much.
I try to really obey God in the realm of giving and receiving and I think that’s really helped us.
And I think it’s really worked.
What did you say your net worth of this building is?
Oh, it’s the county valuation for this building is $22 million. And it’s supernatural. We bought it for 5.7.
And then you moved in. It was debt.
Yeah, and so we won the auction for 5.4 million. Supernatural, We found out about it five days after the banks foreclosed and bought it 30 days after it foreclosed. It was supernatural. And we had to have cash to buy, but we had our other building paid off. So we actually took a loan on it, but we already had an offer. God put the whole deal together, supernaturally, and then the build out, this was a miracle in itself. We have a hundred just over 120,000 square foot. And we built it out for $17 a square foot and brought everything up to current code, you know which is unheard of, unheard of to do that for what we had to do. But God, that’s the grace of God. He helped us. And so we have 7.7 million invested in the project. The two buildings next to us were built at the same time by the same builder. And shortly after we bought this, they paid 30 million for those two buildings. They’re about the average square foot of this building. And they were like this in original condition. So you could say that we bought this for a third, they paid 15 million each average, you know less some concessions. We bought this for a third what they paid, and it was supernatural.
The grace of God abounding towards you.
Man, you just can’t beat God given.
No, you can’t.
You know He gave you Jesus. You know we’re gonna take a break in just a few minutes, but I’ve been thinking about the eternal aspect of grace. You know Paul said in 2 Timothy 1:9, that God saved us and called us with a holy calling before the foundation of the world. So that’s eternity past. And then He says in Ephesians 2:7, that He raises up in verse six and made us sit together in heavenly places saved us by His grace. In chapter four five, but verse seven says, so that in the ages to come, He might show the exceeding riches of His grace toward us and His kindness through Jesus Christ I mean. Friends, I wanna tell you about our grace package. I received a “Revelation of Grace” in Andrew Wommack’s ministry in 1994 after I’ve been pastoring for six years. It revolutionized my life and it’s helped me in so many different ways. I actually have been called to preach and filled with the Holy Spirit in Andrew’s ministry 16 years prior to that. But when I received a Revelation of Grace, it changed me. We’ve also included a great teaching from my son Aaron Perdue, on the Abundance of Grace. A single CD on “Entangled,” a great message on grace from Aaron and my series on Galatians, “The Grace of Christ.” You don’t wanna miss this teaching, just like it’s revolutionized my life. It will revolutionize yours. You can share this with your friends. If you don’t wanna call in and get this, you can actually listen to these free on our website at charischristiancenter.com. We wanna get the word to you. Blessings.
You know I don’t know if you ever go back to Lamar and look at where you grew up and all that stuff, but I just went back this last weekend to Arlington, Texas, and I parked at an old park I used to play at, and there was nothing there back then. And I walked all of those places and I was just overwhelmed Lawson thinking about why did God choose me? Why did God.
And how good He is.
And how good He is. Because I mean, there is nothing, there is nothing in my life that if other people would’ve been picking and choosing somebody that God is gonna use to be on television all over the world and do the things He’s allowed me to do, they wouldn’t have picked me. I wouldn’t have picked me. You probably wouldn’t have picked yourself.
And yet look at the grace of God what He’s done. And between the two of us, we are rich billions. Billions of people.
Billions of people.
And things are happening. People’s lives are changed.
You know I’m like that. And my best friend from high school recently called me and he’s born again. He lives down in Garden City, Kansas. And he’s been very, we hadn’t talked for years, but his nephew had called me and I asked for his number, and then I called and left him a message, and then he called me back. But you know he was talking about how thankful he is and I was talking to him, you know I thank God for my tennis shoes. I go swim nearly every morning. And you know I swim in our neighborhood, we live in the nicest neighborhood in Colorado Springs. And you know God gave us that house in the down townn. You can’t even buy a little bitty house in a bad area for what I picked for my, and it’s supernatural, the grace of God.
No, it’s a beautiful home.
And it’s worth three times now what we paid for. It’s just unreal.
I just about everything you’ve ever touched, set your hand’s on been blessed. Sounds like scripture, doesn’t it?
I’ve had some challenges, but you know what? God’s been with me.
No, but I’ve seen you blessed in everything you do.
He helps us.
And again it’s the grace of God that’s making all of this stuff work.
Paul’s like, it’s not me, but it’s the grace of God that was with me and the grace of God. You know He talks about this, we started in Galatians chapter one, but he makes this statement and he said, “When it please God, who called me from my mother’s womb to reveal His grace in me.” And you know what? If there’s grace from eternity past to eternity future, when we get saved, we enter into that grace. But then if we just stay connected to the gospel and grace, it’s amazing what it, the gospel, what grace will produce in our life and what grace will do for us. And that’s in verse 15. He says this, and I’d like you to comment on this in verse 11 and 12, he says, “I certify to you brethren that the gospel, which was preached of me is not after man, for I didn’t receive it of man neither was I taught it. But by the revelation of Jesus Christ.” When do you think Paul got a revelation of Christ?
I believe it was when he was in the wilderness, in the deserts of Arabia for three and a half years. Because according to these very verses here, and it goes into chapter two, he says that when God revealed Himself, He was in Damascus and then they sought to kill Him. So they had to let Him down over the wall in a basket.
I was just reading about.
And he went into the desert of Arabia for three and a half years. And then he says, after that desert experience, He went and saw Peter, but He was only with him for 15 days. And He also saw John, but He didn’t get anything from them. And the context of all of this is when He went back to Jerusalem in the 15th chapter of the Book of Acts for the conference that they did about hearing about the Gentiles, And do these Gentiles have to become Jews? Do we have to circumcise them and then keep the law for them to have a relationship? And so He was saying that, “No, I got this. I didn’t get this from Peter or John. I got this directly from God by revelation.” And we mentioned that earlier, that grace is so different than the way the whole world system operates. That every one of us, the world that we live in is all based on performance. That there is no precedent for it. And you have to understand grace by revelation. You can’t explain it to a person. God just has to.
And you know I started with you when I was 14, saved when I was eight, started with you 14. I was pastor to church for six years. And before I got a revelation of grace, inevitably it’s when you were preaching for me. And you know it just like a light turned on. And it’s just like that simple, it just flooded my understanding.
The way I got a revelation of grace, it began and of course it took a long time for me to get rid of all the religious stuff that had been taught me. But the way that I got a revelation of grace, I got born again when I was eight, same as you. But I became a religious Pharisee thinking that God owed me something because I was living holy. And I lived totally than the pastor of the church. I lived totally than anybody I knew. And so I thought that God owed me something and I became a Pharisee. And then I was in a prayer meeting March the 23rd, 1968. And the glory of God showed up. I don’t know how to explain it, but I saw the glory of God, not with my eyes. In my heart it was a revelation. I saw how holy and awesome God was. And compared to God, all of my righteousness was like a filthy rag. And man, I repented. I thought God was gonna kill me. And instead of killing me, I had a supernatural tangible love of God just flow over me for four and a half months. And it was great. But it was confusing because my whole thing was, I’ve gotta do something to earn God’s favor. And it was when I finally realized how ungodly I was, and I quit trusting in myself. And I just said, “Oh God, I have mercy on me a sin.” That’s when I experienced the love of God. So that’s when I got a revelation of grace. I knew God’s love for me had nothing to do with my goodness. It had everything to do with Him being love. But it took me years to renew my mind, to begin to understand it to where I could live it. You know, and this is another thing, that if you don’t understand these things, you could have an experience where God touches you, but if you don’t understand it, you’re eventually gonna lose it. Because as you think in your heart, that’s the way that you will be. Proverbs 23:7. So if you’re thinking is screwed up, it doesn’t matter what kind of experience you have, you are gonna lose it. Ultimately, if you don’t get your theology straightened out. It’s very important.
So we need to renew our mind in the Word of God.
That’s why we’re here teaching the word of God.
That’s why you’re on TV’s, why we do everything we do.
Amen. So people can understand what Jesus has done for them. That’s really grace.
And you know all of this fits into being a disciple instead of just a convert. The church has been emphasizing people coming to the Lord praying a prayer. And they may get an experience, they may or may not, I don’t think that signing a card makes you a Christian. But many of those people will actually experience the Lord and get born again. But if we don’t disciple them and teach them, they will eventually lose all of that. It’s gonna be according to the way they think. Your mind is like the central control. Your heart is the part that relates to God, and God speaks to you through your heart, but if you don’t get your head straightened out, you’ll mess it up every single time.
So what you believe in your heart, you know when I wrote this book on Provision: Releasing Supernatural Increase In Your Life, and you wrote, and both you and Jesse Duplantis wrote forward for me, but you both essentially said the same thing. It’s like if you don’t believe it, it’s not gonna work for you. And you know all my boys, they’re 32, 34, or gonna tune 34, I’m gonna be 36, but all my boys are supernaturally blessed. But number one they believe, right? They believe that God’s for them. They believe that God wants to prosper from them. You know but they have a good mentality. They think well and they were just raised that way and they have a good work ethic and they have a good attitude. And you put that all together and it works out good.
But thank God for the grace of God. And you know how the grace of God has changed our lives and what the grace of God produces, and just God is good. You know we talked just a little bit at the beginning about how you were teaching for me when I received a revelation of grace, and I’d been pastoring for six years, but you know it just like became a revelation that it, it’s not how much you’ve broken God’s law. You know, and I’ll quote it again, but it’s like you said, it’s like a plate glass window. It doesn’t matter whether you drove a Mac truck through it or you shot it with a BB-gun. The only way to make it perfect is replace it.
There was a man that was pastoring here in Colorado Springs, this is before you came here. So you may not have known him, but he was such a legalist that he said that if you drove 56 miles an hour–
Oh it’s horrible.
In a 55 mile an hour. No, that’s horrible for you because you drive fast. I’ve been with you. But anyway, he said, if you drove 56 at a 55 mile an hour zone, and if you had a car wreck and died, you’d go to hell even though you been a Christian for a long time because you broke the law. And God said, “Obey the laws of the land.” Now, see, most people wouldn’t agree with that, but if there are people that would say if you committed adultery and then you were on your way home and had a car wreck before you had time to confess it, that you’d die and go to hell. But that’s in inequitable, because if sin could cause you to lose your salvation, well then, which sin is it? You have to start saying there’s big sins and little sins, acceptable sins and unacceptable. But the Bible says in James 2:10, “If you keep the whole law and offending one point.”
You’re guilty of it all.
So, man, if they understand the law, they’ll get out from under that and start trusting the grace of God.
Amen. You know my aunt she came to your Bible stage of roots. She said the same thing. Listen, when I drove worse than I do now, and she said, “If you go 56,” it’s when I said, “Auntie, I have fast angels.”
She said that’s when the angels jump up the car.
They leave my car. I got fast angels. And I had a woman in my church in Kit Carson that gave me grief over that. And she got like three tickets going like 36 into 35 and 56 into 55. And she said, “I’m gonna quit judging you.” And so we gotta be careful how we judge other people, but thank God for the grace of God. Amen. And He helps us in so many ways. But you know it’s not our performance. It’s the performance of Jesus. And when you really understand Jesus, we’ve brought this out all week, it’s not gonna cause you to live worse. It’s gonna cause you to live better. When I got a revelation of grace, I live 10 times better with 10% of the effort. Because I understand it’s not me, but it’s the grace of God.
Well, it’s not you, but it’s Christ living in you. Christ lives in you through grace, not through works. If you are in works, He won’t flow through you.
Amen. So God is really good to us and He demonstrated that in Jesus. You know the Bible says in Romans 8:31 and verse 32 he said, “If God before us who can be against us? He that spared not his own son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall He the Father not with Him, the Son freely give us all things.” You know if God would give you Jesus when you’re a sinner and save you, why wouldn’t God heal your body? Why wouldn’t God give you peace? Why wouldn’t God prosper you? And you know what? He’s provided all of those things through His grace. You know if you need prayer, give us a call. If you’d like to partner with us. You know we’re sharing the gospel all around the world. And if you’d like to partner with us, we would love to hear from you. And if you want we have a special product that we’ve made of this teaching this week with Andrew Wommack. Be sure and give us a call. We would love to hear from you. Thanks for tuning in. Tell your friends about the broadcast. God bless you.
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